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Spear guns - good for home defense?

13K views 57 replies 22 participants last post by  culinariccockroach 
#1 ·
Spear guns are legal in many countries, including some that otherwise ban any other half way powerful weapon.

They happen to be quite effective. Heavy ammo, strong draw weights - yes, that works. Momentum rules.

I have ordered and tested several compact models, and I think with a little bit of tuning (= double up the rubber), they are quite devastating at short ranges typical for home defense scenarios.

I also want to make a model myself, from water proof material - but with two shots. I have a deep mistrust against single shot weapons for defense. Seems to risky to bet all your money on a single horse.

I plan to upload the vid this coming Sunday!
 
#4 · (Edited)
Sorry Joerg but a Spear-Gun is single use, and therefore if you don't hit on the first try it's pretty much done as you won't have the time to reload, about the same as with a crossbow.
Even a dual shot one would be rather critical if you are alone and/or its more than just one attacker.
Also i would consider a spear gun pretty much lethal so that might be worth noting as you might be in for man slaughter if you were to spear-gun somebody down :D

If i would have to choose a legal less than lethal home defense "gun" that is most-likely legal everywhere i would go with a paintball marker and rubber-coated marbles i think they are called "breaker balls", they fly at around 300fps and have devastating effects and the best of all they are exactly as large as your regular paintball and therefore you have just as many shots which should be around 50-100Shots.
And with a electronic trigger they are pretty much full auto with a bit of training :)

Check them out:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBcFSeUx6JQ[/ame]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpqySGUYhBY[/ame]

And last not but least the "inner workings"

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQdZu2FRv4g[/ame]


Have fun!
 
#9 · (Edited)
lol there's that, plus you will also one day have to explain to a judge why you have dude pinned to your garage door :p

The phrase "caught in the act" comes to mind :D



Jörg, I can't wait to see your build, especially the trigger mechanism. I looked at some DIY speargun builds a while ago, and the mechanisms that were used seemed very elaborate and/or expensive, so I'm very much looking forward to your solution.
 
#10 ·
Paint ball markers are limited to 7,5 J in Germany... forget those for home defense.

So far my tests with the Spear Gun are quite encouraging. Absolutely lethal on distances up to 5 meters, then they drop down pretty much because of the heavy, slow bolt (massive steel).

I am also testing a compressed air type, nice performance but it takes FOREVER to pump it up again. That is a no go.
 
#11 ·
Just thinking.... Wouldn't a compact slingbow be much easiert to handle and reload in close quarter scenarios? Something like your african goddess, which would also pack a good punch when used as a bludgeoner.
 
#12 ·
I don't think so. You only have one shot with a bow. Even if you really practice, how long does it take you to fumble a new arrow in, clamp the release on and fire? At least 20 seconds. That is enough time for the intruder to kill you with your own bed lamp.

The beauty of rubber powered spear guns is that you have the arrows already in the lock. All you have to do to make them ready for the shot is drawing back the bands (with the butt pressed against your chest) and lock them into the groove of the projectile. Takes you maybe 5 seconds per "barrel". Then you have a weapon that can fire two shots within a fraction of a second.
 
#13 ·
if we are seriously talking about home defence, i wouldn't go for any ranged weapon.
if anyone is close enough to charge you i think it's best to go for a melee weapon such as
ye olde aluminium baseball bat or kitchen knife.

...i think we all see where this is going.
this thing is gonna need some spikes :D
 
#16 ·
I wonder how long a rubber powered weapon can be left standing there cocked?
For I was taught by you that rubber is a thermal energy "accu" - will the gun be
constructed in a way that it's cocked right before the shot?


Kind regards,

Be
 
#17 · (Edited)
There is a Video on YouTube (it wasn't one of yours i think?) of an old man with arthritis that build himself a battery powered Crossbow with a self-reloading mechanism that actually had about i think 10-15ish Arrows in it's magazine and quite good cadence.

Also did you ever try to rebuild something like this?
Also comparing all of your recent contraptions I'd say you probably be better off with your compression-powered Arrow-Gatling, probably even more so if you managed to adapt a regular 300bar Paintball Air Tank so that you wouldn't have to pump all the six coke-bottles by pure muscle-power :)

And regarding the Paintball-Markers how do they actually regulate that they just have 7,5Joule?
To my knowledge you Guys are limited to about 215ish fps right? And this is achievable with regular 7,5Joule Markers i guess?
So comparing the weight of a regular Paintball which goes in at about 3 to 3,2 grams we are talking about a difference which is at best twice the weight (6grams).
I just weighted a regular marble which comes out to be 5,36g with an additional rubber-coat it would probably get at the maximum to a weight of (6grams) if at all. a thin bit of rubber layer barely acting as a sealant isn't going to ad that much weight.

Also please correct me if i am wrong, but isn't the 7,5J Limit measured with regular (therefore 3g) Paintballs and would an increase in projectile-weight of almost the double result in significant higher Joule-Output if the velocity drop wouldn't be too big? (That is the big IF as i couldn't find any numbers where this was tried out with "German" paintball guns.)
Still i hardly doubt that the velocity would drop drastically with this kind of ammunition to a level on which it would be considered "not harmful at all", i found a Video of as far as i can tell a German guy which tries out shooting marbles with silly results, but i wouldn't consider this something out of the ordinary as regular marbles are 14mm wheres .68 are 17mm so no sealing no velocity...

Also don't underestimate the effects of your regulated Paintball-Gun even with regular Paintballs.
On close distance (5-10M) you definitely get bruises that hurt like a mofo.
And now imagine getting shoot with 20-40 of those in a second if need be right in the face? And still having at least 80 more left if it really need be?

Lets face it in Germany you are screwed if you don't want to go the close distance way of fighting of an attacker and aren't one of the few gun-owners in 82Millions.
The only viable exception you have that is forgiving if you don't hit on first try are probably paintball guns & nail guns, although you probably gonna tell me next that they are restricted too :D

Regarding Bows, as an avid archery nut since childhood and a bow-hunter since adolescence i can tell you forget about a Bow as a self-defense weapon in close quarters!
There are techniques to reload and shoot arrow pretty fast but forget about doing them in confined spaces an arrow alone is about 30-ish" long and a bow capable of fast reloading with proper training (hardly imaginable with shorter axle-to-axle compounds) is at least 56" axle-to-axle.
And BTW. the only benefit a sling-bow is its compact size that might sound intriguing at first (confined space remember?) but doesn't change the fact that in all other regards it fells behind a regular bow as the arrows are just as large and reloading them as fast is simply impossible.
There are just two things Pro-Slingbow and that is compactness and that you will get a good aim with them faster than with your regular bow.

Also lets do some reality-check here shall we?
Most home invasions happen ether on holidays on broad daylight / night or at night on regular days so now imagine hearing noise coming from downstairs so what would be the first thing i do?
Getting my Quiver and Bow in my half-asleep state and go "hunting" for those sneaky little thieves?

It just doesn't sound realistic at all to me, also one should never underestimate the impact that this could have legally if you happen to kill somebody by pinning him to your wall and that somebody happened to be armed with nothing at all.

"Yes Mr. Coroner i totally acted in self-defense when i pinned that life threatening thief with my self made spear-gun contraption to the wall... twice."

Doesn't sound right now does it? ;)
I guess you could still dig up a hole in the backyard if SHTF (or better yet SHTT Spear hit the thief ;) ), which is one of many benefits of country-side living, aye? :D


EDIT: @BeMahoney not long at all, even Bows & Crossbows shouldn't be left stringed up for a prolonged time because the bow-strings get longer&longer and rubber is even worse by a multitude in this regards but to give you a few numbers, Recurve-Bows shouldn't be left stringed for more than 3-6months tops if you want to have adequate String-Life the same applies to Crossbows except that you can actually cock them and to quote a Crossbow Manufacture CEO you shouldn't let your crossbow cocked for more than 1-2 hours tops or else your string-life will be reduced drastically.

@DaveyJones

In Germany where an invader is most-likely not in possession of a gun i would go with a chainsaw if it would need to be a close-range weapon for two reason:

1) Is there anything more frighting than the sound of a chainsaw in a room that was previously dead silent in the middle of the night?

2) It is a f... chainsaw! ;)


EDIT2: Sorry for the Text-Wall :)
 
#18 ·
I wonder how long a rubber powered weapon can be left standing there cocked?
For I was taught by you that rubber is a thermal energy "accu" - will the gun be
constructed in a way that it's cocked right before the shot?


Kind regards,

Be
Be, I would not leave it cocked for a longer time. But the advantage of the spear guns is that you can put in the arrows before you cock the bands, then you can very very quickly hook the string into the notches of the arrow and you are good to go. I'll show that in the video.

A normal sling-x-bow requires inserting the arrows after you have cocked the bands, which takes plenty of time.

Paint balls, well I would not want to make the intruder angry - so IF I would shoot at an attacker, a hit must end the fight for good.

My best weapon that I have so far for the purpose is the Python crossbow with the six shot magazine.
 
#19 ·
Also lets do some reality-check here shall we?
Well, don't forget that I run an entertainment channel on YouTube, and the purpose of my inventions is to entertain my audience.

People love to see takes on home defense, such videos usually get many views. That is why I explore these options. In reality I'd certainly only use force against an intruder if I see no other chance to save my family. Not worth the legal hassle otherwise.
 
#21 ·
For home defense I think size is a determining factor.
Manage a slingshot style "cannon" in the house would be something really hard.
I bet my flechetes or even my darts making a strategic use, because no one knows better my residence than myself.
logically, that if the attacker has a gun, great care is, and the whole concept has to be rethought.
I look forward to the Video Joerg.
 

Attachments

#22 ·
Hello Jörg,

im very intrested in the home defense video, in germany we dont have allot of chance to defense our home legal.



Well, don't forget that I run an entertainment channel on YouTube, and the purpose of my inventions is to entertain my audience.

People love to see takes on home defense, such videos usually get many views. That is why I explore these options. In reality I'd certainly only use force against an intruder if I see no other chance to save my family. Not worth the legal hassle otherwise.
 
#24 ·
In theory a double barreled design should be possible.

The fastest I think would be the old fashioned kind of fishing spear, being a wooden shaft with a point on one end and rubber loop on the other.

Pick it up, one hand holds the band, other pulls spear back. Band hand closes on the spear haft. When you release your grip it goes. Not as long of range I think, but big increase over what the hand arm can do speed wise.

Have 3 or more sitting in the corner by your bed. Fire one, grab next, pull back, fire 2. I think it would be fast.

But the easiest way would be to move to the USA and buy a good 5 shot pump shotgun.
I don't sleep well without mine close. By the time my feet hit the floor my hands can reach it.
I keep mine fully loaded, but the action is open, can not possibly fire by accident.
Less than a second from feet hitting the floor I have 5 12 gauge birdshot rounds ready to rock and roll. Slugs and buckshot are right there also, but I don't see me using either inside the house.

Mind that birdshot is for defense, close range, less than 20 feet 9 meter defense.
And at that range it is just as lethal as the others, but will not go through 3 walls and kill a loved one like the others could do.

Be SURE of your target, know what is behind it. Always.
 
#25 · (Edited)
Sorry but moving to the US because Guns aren't easily obtained in Germany is pretty silly really :) The chances of a homicidal home invasion are quite a bit higher in the US no matter the amount of 12-Gauge at home than they are in Germany or if we want to compare more equally proportioned "country" say European Union. :) I too think that Germany should have more liberal (not liberated) gun-policies but honestly there are even worse ones. Just try obtaining a gun in Japan for example now that is a hole different story, trust me as a gun-owner even importing them into the country is damn near impossible. The funny thing is their Austrian neighbors can easily obtain a shotgun as soon as they are 18 Years old (read legal age) without a problem if the background check is fine.
 
#26 ·
There was an incident not too long ago mentioned in the news here in Germany.
A burglar broke into a hunters home in the middle of the night. The hunter woke up, grabbed his hand gun and shot the burglar. The burglar died and the hunter is under investigation for homicide. He claimed the burglar was armed with a knive. Well... if he wasn´t the hunter will probably go to jail... so much for german laws =/
But thats the reason, why i switched to solid rubberballs in the slingshots beside my bed instead of steel balls.
They will hurt but most likely not kill a burglar.
 
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